Belief in a conciliatory style to achieve political change
This passage reveals something about Spaulding's posture on leadership, activism, and race relations. He believes in forward-thinking leadership, he says, but also that mediation solves more problems than partisanship. He cites one case in which he believes his influence, carefully cultivated through his conciliatory style, resulted in the appointment of a city official friendly to blacks and whites.
Citing this Excerpt
Oral History Interview with Asa T. Spaulding, April 16, 1979. Interview C-0013-3. Southern Oral History Program Collection (#4007) in the Southern Oral History Program Collection, Southern Historical Collection, Wilson Library, University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.
Full Text of the Excerpt
- WALTER WEARE:
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I don't want to sidetrack that, but it brings up an
interesting issue, that you probably had as much insight on as anybody,
and that's this notion of class conflict in the black
community. Some suggest that it's actually greater than in
the white community. That feeling runs higher. Over your life, do you
see that as a big issue?
- ASA T. SPAULDING:
-
If it has been in the past, I don't think it's so
today. And in saying that, I'm not saying it has been in the
past; I don't know. Because what I have always tried to do is
move around with all people. As much as my time restraints would permit
me. Because you see a person in as many things as I was in, and on the
go and moving, things you have to do, there's only so much
time that you have to actually mingle. And I've been able to
mingle more since I retired, than I was before. And I think I have a
better feel of the pulse of the community since entering public life,
than I did before. So I cannot throw any light on
that situation. I guess a lot depends on to whom you talk.
- WALTER WEARE:
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But in general, abstracting yourself from it, do you think this has been
an issue in the so-called black middle class? There's
sometimes the charge that when somebody makes it, then they forget about
the people.
- ASA T. SPAULDING:
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I'm sure that during the boycott in 1968 that that became a
definite issue. And it's something that my wife had to face.
Because the fact that she had organized another group. Even though this
group insisted on equal representation, black and white, on the
committees and things. I told her this. "The best role that you
can play is that of a mediator, or arbitrator. You have the protagonists
on both sides. If you line up with either side, you'll
destroy your effectiveness and credibility with the other."
- WALTER WEARE:
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One group wanted there to be an all-black committee, and there was the
other group of white women who had never sat with a black person in
their life.
- ASA T. SPAULDING:
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And not only that. The community, the merchants association and everybody
else—in other words, if they say you're just an
addition to the black solidarity committee, there's no reason
for us to talk with you at all. Or even negotiate. If you take the role
that you're trying to get the facts of the case, and get them
out to the public, and let the public decide. Just like Nehru I was
telling you about. The State Department told me they had to use Nehru as
their means of communication with the Russians. And the State Department
was in favor of, and understood his position and all. And it was the
only way he could be useful. Because if he was in our camp, they
wouldn't be talking with him anymore than they would direct
to us. And it was on the basis of that experience in 1956, that I knew
if they took a position for either, it would destroy their effectiveness
with the other. And I was right. Time proved that
that was the role for them to play. But in the early part of it,
especially when the negotiations were hot, they were accused of being
more a part of the problem than a part of the solution. And the things
that I did in public office. It was during, I think, my first term.
Because when I went there, we had no blacks in the courthouse in any of
the positions. It wasn't my first term; it was second term
that the farm agent for the county, a black man succeeded the white farm
agent before. See, when I was elected, the first thing I did was to
write the other four commissioners a letter—I think it was a
page-and-a-half— telling them that now that I was a member of
the board and would be working with them, I wanted to share with them
some of my thinking, and some of my philosophy. And I thought that if we
wanted to play the role of leadership in the community, we ought to play
that role, and not be reacting rather than acting. They knew about the
demonstrations that were going on, the boycott and all of that, and how
they were putting a premium on violence, and boycotting, and protesting.
How that was the only way they could get anything done. And I
didn't think we ought to wait until we had demonstrations
down there in the courthouse and things of that nature. And I sent it to
them at their homes. And I started it off in a way that they would start
reading it and would go on and finish reading it. You know, you can turn
a person off in the beginning, and no matter what you say
thereafter— something they might even accept. So I just
started off, and step-by-step. And they had an appreciation for it. You
see, I could have waited until in a meeting, and some issue came up, and
could have made a big speech and embarrassed them, or taken sides with
somebody, which would have embarrassed them. And the matter of our
working relationship for the rest of the term would have been destroyed.
But I told them in front and had hopefully
stimulated their thinking. And the result was, when this white farm
agent for the county reached retirement age, the county manager, knowing
my position, went down to North Carolina State University, and talked
with the people down there. You see, the extension for the farmers was
under there. And they knew Carl Hodges. He was assistant to the county,
and had been for many years, well-trained, A & T State
University. Very competent person. He said, "Now forget about
his race and just give me an objective opinion as to whether or not you
think he can handle the job and can get along with the
farmers." And they told him they thought he could do it. And
with that information, he went to the other members of the
commissioners, and imparted the information to them. And then he came to
me and told me what he had done, and wanted to know if I was in favor of
it. I told him I thought he did the right thing, yes, and I thought if
the man was competent he ought to be given the position. And I
appreciated the effort that he'd spent in trying to pave the
way for him. Well, we had the meeting and his name was on the list for
consideration. And he was approved unanimously. Because the proper
groundwork had been done. And he was excellent. All the farmers, white
and black, think the world of him. He's been there since
either '69 or probably '70. So it's
been nine years now. And he's a very popular person. And then
more and more blacks were brought into the courthouse without ever any
protest or any demonstrations resulting from it.
- WALTER WEARE:
-
Do you think you could have been as effective with the protest on one
side to work against?
- ASA T. SPAULDING:
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No. That's why, you remember, I went back and said in every
stage of the building of North Carolina Mutual, and the equipment that
was needed in completing its job. And I said you need all of these
things. Just like that black boycott.