Need you guess? Not a thing. Nothing was done. The campus police did
absolutely nothing. Now, if you are going to stopt violence on one side,
you stop violence on the other. The campus did not stop violence for
people that were working for us, they did not stop people from insulting
those workers, ;this kind of situation. So, that led up to that
incidence that night, and the press you know, made a big play on that
and everything. Then the question came up, for the University, "How do
we handle this situation." After that night that the governor sent in
the State Troopers, now that was mistake number one on the old
governor's side. That was a big mistake.
Page 26 Because
when he sent in the State Troopers, a lot of students who never would
have been involved, who were in the middle and passive, became involved
in on the workers' side of the issue simply because of the State
Troopers on campus. They did not like this idea. And the faculty
members. Faculty people…people are always throwing about faculty and
education…I don't think nothing about a faculty member. You give me a
town like Raleigh or Durham and give me some real people. I don't like
educated people much. Because they have a tendency to talk a lot, to
theorize a lot, but don't do shit. When trouble was coming down there,
you couldn't catch a University official out there to see what was going
on. No witness to say that the campus police brutalized people. No
witnesses to say that the people were being hurt. The only university
people that they had down there were the campus police. And you know
what story they are going to say. But none of these supposedly big-time
faculty people made it their business down there to see. Now it seems to
me that the AAUP or somebody would have said, "We want to keep somebody
to watch everything that goes on down here at this strike. To watch so
that we can report what we saw happened in that strike. Put an unbiased
voice in this thing here." It seems to me that the faculty would have
been interested in that, but you find out that the faculty is very
conservative too, and there were a lot of faculty
Page 27
members who felt the very same way, you know, "that we don't want to be
involved. This is the kind of thing that we would like to shoo from our
minds. Just get it out of here, it does not exist. These people down
here are just in another world and I'll avoid it, just stay away from it
and go downtown and eat." And this is what happened. O.K., well once the
troopers came on campus, that really caused a stink, because that made
national press and then the University's reputation nationally, and I
think that the University is always reflecting in it's national
reputation and it's local, well, Bob Scott, who I consider a very inept
governor, too and I think that the people of North Carolina, it has
increased my faith in them by giving him the lowest rating of any
governor they've had, by the end of his term in office. He did
absolutely nothing. Him and Dan K. Moore. The Democrats couldn't have
won again, after they put Dan K. Moore and Bob Scott in office during
those two sessions. Both of them were just terrible. Now, Terry Sanford,
he was a whole different way from what came after him. Well, he sent
these State Troopers on campus. And we talked with some of these State
Troopers, they'd say, "Look man," we'd be out in the morning and they'd
have to come over there and push us back so that we couldn't talk to
those workers going in and we talked to some of them and they'd say,
"Look, we have no hassle with you. As far as we're concerned, you can
have the damn cafeteria. I want to be home." I heard that a good number
of State Troopers
Page 28 quit behind that, I'm not sure.
And I understand this caused a change in tactics, in which they would
have a special unit out of Asheville to handle all these little
problems. I guess that this is North Carolina's version of the tactical
police. But a lot of people were very unhappy. Because they hated
getting up at six o'clock in the morning, they didn't like it and they
didn't want to be on campus. Because, number one, I think that some of
them had kids on the campus and it proved very embarrassing for
everybody, I believe. It proved embarrassing for the police, it proved
embarrassing just for kids around on campus. It just was real bad for
everybody.
So, while this was going on, we got us a record player and we were over
in Manning and we were laying it on them, "don't eat in the pig pen with
the pigs" and all this kind of good old action. And oh, by the way, the
governor called the Chancellor on the telephone and said, "I don't care
what you said about that building, I want those students out of there."
So, the Chancellor didn't want to look real bad, he didn't want to go
back on his words, I guess. He didn't want to use force. So, what he
did, he sent campus police over every night to come through the building
and what they would attempt to do was to catch the building at one
time…and they would come through there and lock doors systematically as
they through and if they could catch that building empty, they would
lock it up. You see what I mean? And lock people out and then arrest
anybody that tried
Page 29 to break back in. See, that was
the strategy, to lock you out. So, we had to keep black students in
there twenty-four hours a day, so we slept over there. A lot of us slept
over there in order to keep the police from coming in and throwing
people out. O.K., so like I say, this kind of generated things and we
got more white kids involved, more involved in what was going on.
Finally the decision came up, the thing came to a head. While all this
was going on, by the way, let me tell you what was happening. The
University, it was planned, certain things had been planned. Like when
we got arrested at Lenoir, after Lenoir, warrents were being prepared
and over in the PoliSci Department and over in the Institute of
Government, strategy was being planned. "How can we punish these
students and satisfy some people in Raleigh, but at the same time, not
anger a lot of other people in North Carolina." Either way it was a
touchy situation. "How can we punish these students involved in this
cafeteria thing in a way that won't cause our normally passive faculty
and staff to get up on end. If we punish these kids too hard, it might
cause problems." This was the way that we saw it. It might cause a
general strike, and that would be a problem. "And we have seen what has
happened already by being inactive and not doing some things generally
with these kids. We've seen what kinds of problems happened, so we need
to do something." All right, so what they did, they worked on the
strategy, and the word that come from Raleigh was
Page 30
that we were supposed to be arrested. That was the word from Raleigh,
"You arrest." Now, a couple of things they said. First of all, "Clear
them kids out of Manning." I told you what his first strategy was.
Second thing was, "Arrest those people in that cafeteria strike. Because
no blacks in North Carolina are going to go up there and take over a
state university cafeteria." I can see that echoing in the old halls of
Raleigh right now. That was part of it. So, like I say, the people at
this end were faced with the problem of how they could keep trouble from
escalating. So, the word I got was that there was a strategy being
planned and warrents were being drawn up over this period of time. This
is right after the cafeteria strike and on. So, we had gone on for
awhile for then, so finally, they really had the strategy and they had a
big day they had planned and everything. So, what they did, on the
morning of this particular day, the Chancellor of the University called
Julius Chambers and told him that he ought to come to Chapel Hill. This
is what I understand. The attorney. Because certain parties are going to
be arrested. All right, the Chapel Hill police were out in battallions
to serve some warrents. And I mean, they were in full battle dress to
serve these warrants, by the way. I think they served ones to six
people. All this is in one day now. I was in class that day. I had gone
to class and a lot of white kids and everybody, and what the police had
done… I didn't even know it was going on, but when I got out of class,
Page 31 the State Troopers had Manning completely
surrounded, see. We kept hearing noise and the kids pushing in and the
State Troopers, "Get back, get back." You know. So, what had happened,
this is when they took over the building. My understanding is that
Howard Fuller just happened to be over here, I don't know how he was
here. Somebody called him, or he showed up, I don't know what on that
day. But Howard Fuller was going in and everybody made the assumption
that the brothers in the building were going to stand there and try to
hold the building against the armed with guns State Troopers. Which was
foolish. I mean, this was foolish. People wondered what in the
world…they laughed about that. That's foolish. You think we were going
to stand out there and get shot? It's one thing to stand out there with
some canes and all and talk junk with the police, I mean, all he's got
is a stick and all you've got is a stick and ya'll out there battling.
Now, we had one morning when we thought that the police were going to
try and… and this is where I say that the tactics of making the legal
illegal was first used on the strike when they had a group of people and
what they would do, they closed off their end of the cafeteria and we
came out, we were around at the northern end at this part, where you
enter at that little back door at the side, marching. They said that we
were marching too far out and they wanted to close us in to march some.
So, they kept closing in the march and closing in the march. Well, it
gets to a point where you can't close in
Page 32 the march
anymore, because the people involved in the march. Well, this is where
the illegality comes in. So, a guy comes out with a megaphone and says,
"Well, you marching there, I'm only going to tell you one more time,
don't go out of the marching area." You couldn't understand the guy.
"What we say is this," is what he was saying, "when we see the
opportunity, we're going to beat you." And you could look down the
street and you could see the police cars sitting like this, you know,
one on one side of the street and one on the other and if you have
watched any movies about New York City, you know that when that happens…
they had pulled the police cars down, they had barricaded all around the
area, so when we went out there, we said, "These cats, man, they want to
beat some ass this morning. They want to beat somebody." So, we went on
into Manning and looked out and we wouldn't come out there. Anyway, so
when I got out of there, I went running over to the middle of campus and
there were a lot of students standing around in the middle of the
campus. Things had really kind of come to a head and we found out that
some warrants had been issued for some arrests and some of the kids who
had heard that there were some warrants out for them had already kind of
been ducked out and they went over to Michael Katz's house, who was an
attorney, a law instructor in the Law School. And we all sat around at
his house waiting for Chambers, who we found out the Chancellor had
called already to come to Chapel Hill.